runflat Posted June 15, 2005 Report Share Posted June 15, 2005 I have been through nearly all of the posts in the cleaning Forum right back to 2002 (am off work ) but still can't make my mind up on what products I need. I have lots of scratches in my Brilliant Black paint which I can't seem to shift with Super Resin Polish. I have tried Autoglym Paint Restorer, but this seems a bit harsh and leaves more scrathes than it removes. So...any better suggestions for getting rid of scratches? Other than not buying black paint Also, I intend to change to a wash mitt and Gold Class shampoo for washing, but what after that? Do I need a polish then wax or just a wax? I know this is asking a lot in one go, but I would appreciate any help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malagus Posted June 15, 2005 Report Share Posted June 15, 2005 errrmmm, scratchX? or a clay compound would be good. ermmm.. if you wish to renovate, polish then wax. after just wax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apreading Posted June 15, 2005 Report Share Posted June 15, 2005 If you are doing it by hand the Meguiars Scratch-X is probably about as good as you can get for scratch removal. To do better you need to use a machine which is expensive and needs to be done carefully. Great call with the mitt and Gold class shampoo. I would say an absolute must, no way can you not have this, would be some clay bar. Try the Meguiars Quick clay pack which comes with lubricant and a small bar. You absolutely will not friggin believe what it can so. The idea is that tar, tree sap, dead insect residue etc cling to the clay and get lifted from the surface where normally they would be too tough to shift without something really abrasive. Just do a small section and run your hand over the paint surface - compare with an untreated surface and realise how much cr@p is normally left, you can often even HEAR the difference as you run your hand over it. You absolutely must use some form of wax to seal and protect the surface once you have got it how you want. With a dark car you will reap benefits from polishing first to bring out the deep shine - if you like super resin then that is as good as any, but I hated the white powder that got everywhere. Then follow up with the wax for protection - I would suggest either Autoglym or Gold class (again I prefer the megs stuff) as a starting point unless you want to spend mega-bucks. The wax is your only protection against blemishes and scratches to dont go anywhere without it in a black car in my opinion...! Hope that helps - sure you will get a multitude of answers, but they will probably all be fairly similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runflat Posted June 15, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2005 Cheers for that lads. I have never used wax as I thought polish was the same thing Which specific Megs polish and wax would you recommend if I was to polish then wax after a good wash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apreading Posted June 15, 2005 Report Share Posted June 15, 2005 Many swear by the Meguiars 3 stage as a complete system. The three stage includes a cleaner, polish and wax and all are excellent individually or together. The cleaner is probably superfluous if you clay occasionally and keep the surface clean the rest of the time - it is just a mild product for removing contaminants and prepping the surface for polishing. I would prefer clay any time, but the really devoted would probably do both! The 3 stage system is about £8 per stage, so not cheap but well worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazo Posted June 16, 2005 Report Share Posted June 16, 2005 clay only removes above surface contamination, the stage 1 paint cleaner would be needed for below surface issues, oxidation, ultra minor defects etc. Think of it as a deep cleaning your paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runflat Posted June 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2005 So what about Supagard? How good is that? You can get it off ebay for a fiver so I was thinking maybe I would get some instead of a wax or top coat sealer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Posted June 16, 2005 Report Share Posted June 16, 2005 Does £5 for a product that you've never head of or had any experience sounds like a good idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 16, 2005 Report Share Posted June 16, 2005 [ QUOTE ] Does £5 for a product that you've never head of or had any experience sounds like a good idea? [/ QUOTE ] That's a fair point but SUPAGARD is quite a popular paint sealant sold by dealers up and down the country for £200-300 applied I've heard that it's quite good stuff so for a fiver it's got to be worth a squirt , surely? BUB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Posted June 16, 2005 Report Share Posted June 16, 2005 Fair point but what happens if the £5 squirt mucks up the paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 16, 2005 Report Share Posted June 16, 2005 That would be NASTY! The "real" Supagard is a little sponge in a Supagard bag - so you shouldn't go wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleanimage Posted June 16, 2005 Report Share Posted June 16, 2005 [ QUOTE ] That would be NASTY! The "real" Supagard is a little sponge in a Supagard bag - so you shouldn't go wrong [/ QUOTE ] There are dozens of dealerships all up and down the country who manage to muck it up, and these are people who have actually be trained to apply it. And if it goes wrong, its a bugger to get off again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 [ QUOTE ] if it goes wrong, its a bugger to get off again. [/ QUOTE ] How can it go wrong? Apply it just like a wax/polish- FROM THE SUPAGARD BAG 1)Dampen the sponge 2)Pierce the sponge 2-3 times (to release the sealant) 3)Spread the contents over the painted surface, applying light pressure. 4)Allow to dry to a haze and leave on for at least 30 mins 5)Remove the hazy film using a clean cloth So tell me how can you go wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazo Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 Jesus and they charge £300 for that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 [ QUOTE ] Jesus and they charge £300 for that! [/ QUOTE ] Hell Yeah! But you do get a charming handbag full of stuff - which is just soooooo this season darling BUB Oh and they spray the seats and carpet with a stainguard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazo Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 Oh and they spray the seats and carpet a stainguard. Well why didn't you mention that before, nOw I can see its worth ;-) lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 Come on get your purse out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runflat Posted June 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 Got a bid in on some Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleanimage Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 [ QUOTE ] Jesus and they charge £300 for that! [/ QUOTE ] No there is far more to it than that. I believe you are discussing Gilbert's law that things are always really easy when somebody else is doing it. Heart surgery... how hard can it be? Cut 'em open, reconnect a couple of pipes and sew 'em back up again! Every week we see cars that have sealants applied badly. Far more than we used to thanks to eBay. It used to be the case that the problems we used to see were down to laziness by dealerships, but these days it's often due to people who have not properly prepared the car prior to application due to then not having the instruction booklets telling them how, and not having the correct equipment to do so. You can't see that has been done badly right away, but after about 6 weks your car begins to develop a camoflage effect. It's also worth remembering that a sealant is not a wax or anything like a wax... So it's not designed for easy application by the general public, and it includes none of the ingredients that hide swirl marks and micro-scratches. AS many people on this forum have said, best results come from the preparation, a Sealant will seal in your prepared paintwork, no matter how good or bad it is. It then guarantees it to remain in that condition for 3-7 years depending on the sealant... which is a sod of a long time to be contracted to a customer's car, and goes a long way to explaining why sealant packages are so expensive. There are also health and safety issues with sealants, the aerosol parts of the package are extremely dangerous... I'm not kidding about this either, if you breath in a sealant, you seal your lungs, you die. It's happened, thats why the newer kits are plastered with warning symbols. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazo Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 Whilst I can't disagree with anything you have said Clean image and I have no doubt that your company preps cars properly, your bog std dealership monkey is influenced by volume and not quality, how many swirled cars have you seen that have just left the showroom? Too many to remember no doubt, I do kinda laugh when peopel strive for that showroom finish, look at the cars in teh showroom under the halogen lights and they are swirled and spider webbed. This is why I wouldn't let a dealer wash my car. Using my pc I can polish out with say megs 83 and 80, apply klasse AIO and then their sg glaze in 6 hours (some would say that is too long). That equates to £50 an hour, a dealer will not go to those lenghs. I wonder how many cars have this coating left after the first application of AG SRP (slightly abrasive) none I can tell thee !!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 This post is called "Advice from the cleaning Gurus" And you two certainatly do talk the talk - I trust you walk the walk too? Now I'm NO Guru but I'm proud of the fact that I've kept the car swirl free and as smooth as glass for nearly 9 months I use Zymol Carbon and HD Cleanse. Of course it had to be swirl free to start with and that's why I told the salesman NOT! to have the car washed/cleaned/polished in anyway before delivery I work at a dealership (not VAG). Brazo you're spot on with your comments about "That Showroom Shine" or is that SH*TE It brings a tear to my eye when I see the "Eastern European Type" get the broom of swirl out to "Clean" a brand new car I was wondering about treating the car to Supagard (after proper prep)- Even I can't get it for a fiver! Is it worth using a sealant or do I just keep on with the wax every two months? BUB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 [ QUOTE ] I wonder how many cars have this coating left after the first application of AG SRP (slightly abrasive) none I can tell thee !!!!! [/ QUOTE ] I'll check but I don't think you're supposed to use anything but Supagards own "Paint Seal Cream" once treated..... You get their own shampoo and cream with the after care pack from a dealership. Am I right in saying that Zymol would just sit on top of the sealant? BUB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runflat Posted June 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 So if you ask the dealer not to wash and prepare the car, what state would it arrive to you in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avus_Bub Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 It was ok - De Waxed a few water marks but fine. Ready for me to take over If you look in my gallery you can see how it arrived at the dealership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazo Posted June 17, 2005 Report Share Posted June 17, 2005 You may be right about the paint seal cream Avus but they do supply a goodie bag that contains iirc the SRP. BTW None of those zymol products you mention will have any effect on removing or protecting against swirls so it must be your excellent wash tecnique that has assist you!! Yes zymol can be used to top a sealant as your wax (carbon) is not a cleaner wax unlike the cheap stuff they sell in Halfords. Ps P21s will give you the same results as zymol at half the price, but thats for another thread!! ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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